Talk:Pig
This talk page is for discussing Pig.  



Truffles Per Day
The statement that the average amount of truffles in a day is three for a max happiness pig comes from the claim that the first truffle is pretty much guaranteed and susequent ones have a likeleyhood of 1000/1500 or 2/3.
The first truffle therefore has probalility 1 while the second one has 2/3, the third (2/3)^2 the fourth (2/3)^3 etc.
The average amount of truffles then becomes an infinite geometric series.
1 + 2/3 + (2/3)^2 + (2/3)^3 +....
We call this S and perform some calculations:
S = 1 + 2/3 + (2/3)^2 + (2/3)^3 +....
S*(2/3) = 2/3 + (2/3)^2 + (2/3)^3 + (2/3)^4 +....
S  S*(2/3) = S*(1/3) = 1
S = 3
I did this same calculation and arrived at 2.5 at first becuase I did 1000/1500 in my head and somehow got 3/5. This should be right though. Viktor36 (talk) 22:44, 17 May 2021 (UTC)
 Hi Viktor36, I have a question, so I was attempting to make a program to calculate the amount of truffles for a given friendship and I got 3 EXTRA truffles at max happiness, whereas you got 3 total truffles, I am not good at math but when I was looking at your calculations I noticed that between the
 S = 1 + 2/3 + (2/3)^2...
 Step and the
 S*2/3 = 2/3 + (2/3)^2...
 Step, the 1 seems to dissappear, is that a mistake? If not an explanation of the math would be very helpful.
 Thanks Glad Wrap (talk) 03:22, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
 Apologies, Viktor36 I have reviewed the math and I have seen that that step makes sense, though I still would appreciate an explanation of the math so I can figure out my program. Glad Wrap (talk) 03:58, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
 3 total truffles is the average amount of truffles a pig will produce, not the total it will produce each day. Sometimes it can produce 4, or 2, or 1, or even 100 in a single day due to the random chance involved. User314159 (talk) 21:18, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
 Apologies User314159, I now realize there were clarification issues in my previous posts, I was aware it was an average but I was trying to calculate it with my program and got a different answer, but I spent a few hours reviewing the code and found a mistake, as such the issue can be considered resolved and Viktor36 is correct Glad Wrap (talk) 00:38, 19 January 2022 (UTC)
 Yeah that part was confusing. It’s all good though, no worries. User314159 (talk) 01:39, 19 January 2022 (UTC)
Bug and Floors and pathes
It seens like there's a bug that Pigs inside of Fences kann drop the Truffles outside of the area they have acces to. Example: There's a Pig wich cannot move because 8 Fences are directly next to it. The Pig will produce the Truffles and they will be outside of the Tile, the Pig is standing in.
=Fence; +=Pig; "=Truffle:
   "  +     "
Of course it also works if there are multiple Pigs in a big enclosure.
I can upload a image too if needed...
Also truffles can be dropped on flooring (craftable wood floor in my case), the page sais the opposite. Botautal (talk) 20:37, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
 Hi Botautal, I think truffles spawning outside fences is the way ConcernedApe intended it to work. The alternative is that no truffle spawns at all, so I would say it may be better as a "note" rather than a "bug" on the page.
 It's entirely possible that ConcernedApe fixed the flooring bug in v1.5 and forgot to put it in the change notes. I'll remove it from the page. Thank you, margotbean (talk) 20:44, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
Pig nonproduction days per year
Pigs will produce on approximately 68.3 days per year, out of 112. There are 28 days of winter, and an average of 15.708 rainy days per year. Pigs not producing on nearly 40% of days seemed like it could be a worthwhile inclusion–it actually results in chickens having a slightly higher gold/tile/day output, despite most people thinking pigs are by far the most profitable animal.
I don't know how to format math, so here's an image with a full explanation: https://imgur.com/a/3n7JeoX Let me know if any of it is incorrect but it seems accurate. Information is from Modding:Weather data. Leninheads (talk) 19:51, 4 March 2022 (UTC)
 Truffle Oil sells for a lot more than Mayonnaise, and a pig is capable of producing multiple Truffles in a day. So while there are a lot of days they don't produce, they more than make up for it in the days they do produce. It still might be interesting and informative to include your data, but I have nothing to add in terms of critiquing its accuracy or suggesting how it might be included. Zendowolf (talk) 03:49, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
 Rough numbers: I have 10 fullyfriended pigs in a Deluxe Barn that, over time, produce 15 Truffles on producing days (in my experience), with 34 oil makers at hand. So, 15 Truffle Oil sells for 15,975g (with Artisan skill). In 68 producing days (one year) that comes to about 1,088,000g. That's equivalent to 3817 gold Mayonnaise. I think 10 Chickens can produce a maximum of 1120 eggs a year (one per day per chicken). Seems to fall far short of Truffles' potential, even if there are some extra eggs. Giles (talk) 05:46, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
 Here's where I'm at: it took almost an hour for me to understand the equation and doublecheck it against the Modding:Weather data page. The math seem to check out, within a day of accuracy. (Note that the variable x was changed to n in the equation, but not in the text.) So, if we decide it's worth including on the page, how do we condense the equation into something that can be typed on the wiki, and something that doesn't take 30 minutes to understand? For a bit of trivia about the average number of days a pig might be outside, I'm not sure it's worth it. One player's experience may vary quite a bit from the expected numbers; it's only over time that the numbers prove themselves. margotbean (talk) 19:26, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
 Sorry about that. I could have written it out to be potentially easier to understand but it would have ended up being huge. It was intended less as a "here's why pigs are worse than chickens if you analyze the specific average number of rain days per year and compare that with the amount of tiles required to optimize the truffle/tile efficiency of pigs" kind of thing, I mostly just wanted to point out that pigs don't produce on a lot of days because from my time in the discord server it's not really something anyone considers. Nonproduction days are a pretty important part of pigs, and saying they don't produce on 39.1% of days conveys the information very explicitly. I don't think it's critical that it's mentioned or anything, but I do think it's at least somewhat valuable and was worth bringing up. Leninheads (talk) 00:32, 6 March 2022 (UTC)
 While it's true any player's experience can vary from time to time, over time they tend to converge: just a law of probability. The question is how much convergence over what length of time/experience. I agree that no production on almost 40% of days could be startling to some people, but the effect is really ephemeral. It's a case of an unexpected statistic as an unwarranted attentiongetter  the sort of thing media love to latch onto in news. The question is still the primary premise here that pigs actually are worse than chickens. I would argue "no way" if you consider more than just the animal produce and factor in artisan goods and bonuses. Profit per day is the kind of stat that interests people looking for profit first, and they are the least likely to ignore the artisan/bonus factors. For others, what are eggs and truffles good for? Gifts? Food/cooking? How many do you need then? How big an operation are you going to run? What then is the significance of profit differences? Interesting trivia, perhaps, but... Giles (talk) 00:59, 7 March 2022 (UTC)
 Sorry about that. I could have written it out to be potentially easier to understand but it would have ended up being huge. It was intended less as a "here's why pigs are worse than chickens if you analyze the specific average number of rain days per year and compare that with the amount of tiles required to optimize the truffle/tile efficiency of pigs" kind of thing, I mostly just wanted to point out that pigs don't produce on a lot of days because from my time in the discord server it's not really something anyone considers. Nonproduction days are a pretty important part of pigs, and saying they don't produce on 39.1% of days conveys the information very explicitly. I don't think it's critical that it's mentioned or anything, but I do think it's at least somewhat valuable and was worth bringing up. Leninheads (talk) 00:32, 6 March 2022 (UTC)
 Here's where I'm at: it took almost an hour for me to understand the equation and doublecheck it against the Modding:Weather data page. The math seem to check out, within a day of accuracy. (Note that the variable x was changed to n in the equation, but not in the text.) So, if we decide it's worth including on the page, how do we condense the equation into something that can be typed on the wiki, and something that doesn't take 30 minutes to understand? For a bit of trivia about the average number of days a pig might be outside, I'm not sure it's worth it. One player's experience may vary quite a bit from the expected numbers; it's only over time that the numbers prove themselves. margotbean (talk) 19:26, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
 Rough numbers: I have 10 fullyfriended pigs in a Deluxe Barn that, over time, produce 15 Truffles on producing days (in my experience), with 34 oil makers at hand. So, 15 Truffle Oil sells for 15,975g (with Artisan skill). In 68 producing days (one year) that comes to about 1,088,000g. That's equivalent to 3817 gold Mayonnaise. I think 10 Chickens can produce a maximum of 1120 eggs a year (one per day per chicken). Seems to fall far short of Truffles' potential, even if there are some extra eggs. Giles (talk) 05:46, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
Pig mechanics offfarm and a note on truffles per day
I recently decided to see if I could complete perfection by winter 28, year 2 with some restrictions on what I could sell  basically only "farm products", crops and animal products but no artisan goods. I knew pigs and ancient fruit would be my best money makers. In previous runs, I never seemed to get the 3/day truffle average as stated on the wiki, so I decided to do a practical test on another save file.
First, some minor points. Over three seasons, I got an average of 2.93 truffles per pig per sunny day, so pretty close to the mathematically derived number, BUT  this was AFTER taking the gatherer doubleharvest perk into account. Unfortunately I didn't track the number of truffles produced before that effect, but if we take the stated 20% chance of double harvest that would mean the average truffles actually produced was more like 2.5. I know this was not the most extensive testing, but on the other hand the mathematical derivation assumes ideal conditions  in practice, some pigs hang around inside the barn for a while, or they stand near one another, giving them less free space to find truffles. Maybe a disclaimer could be added to the article to say that in practice the average truffles may be closer to 2.5? Anyway, that's not my main point.
(As an aside  I also found (granted, from only one season of testing) that from the time it takes a mature pig to go from zero to max friendship, it finds an average of about 1.5 truffles/day (after gatherer perk)  so roughly half that of a maxed pig. I thought that might be good information to include on the page.) Pigtesting123 (talk) 03:38, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
Pig mechanics part 2
But, to my main point  I had noticed on previous runs that on days I spent in Skull Cavern or on Ginger Island, I would tend to get fewer truffles. During my testing, I tried this out as well. Since all I had to pay attention to was what the pigs were doing, I noticed the pattern of where truffles were found  it turned out that, if you leave the farm at all, the pigs appear to stop "moving" around the map. They are still capable of finding truffles, but if they are all bunched up right outside the barn door, or not outside the barn yet at all, they will not have available space to find as many. So if you warp off the farm as soon as you wake up, you get hardly any truffles. If you hang around the farm for 23 hours in the morning, the pigs will have spread out enough that you can get about the average number of truffles. This was the main point I thought would be good to include in the article, since it can seriously decrease your truffle yield if you're spending lots of time off the farm and have many pigs. (And one more note  I restarted the day after testing this out, so my numbers above were not affected by the lower truffle yield  those numbers reflect staying on the farm all day.) Maybe this was something others already knew, but I didn't, and it isn't mentioned in the article. Pigtesting123 (talk) 03:39, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 I added a note to the page, immediately after where it says "it's not necessary to stay on the farm for a pig to produce truffles". That seemed like the most logical place. Please feel free to edit the page with any other information you find useful (but remember to keep it brief!) Thanks for the tip, and happy farming! margotbean (talk) 16:10, 7 December 2022 (UTC)